i know many people have been saying that they're tired of these questions and that you must hear the song and interpret it your way, but Im of the opinion that we should share our ideas and points of view, because some people need to know other opinions to form their own! So please don't come here complaining about that, if you don't want to discuss this, then don't, Post only if you're interested.

I also know there are topics discussing the lyrics from the songs individually, but i think it would be more usefull to have one topic to discuss all about the all the songs from POTF.
I simply love this band, their lyrics are amazing they always try to make us meditate on those lyrics to take the essential message from them.

However some lyrics are more difficult to understand than others, the main reason why im trying to start this topic is because im one of those people who would like to see other points of view and compare them with mine about each song.

We need a start so I'll just suggest a song....
Let's take .... Smoke And Mirrors...

"I danced a tango with my hubris high on youth
We swept across the dance floor to subjective truth

But there was no harmony there
No reason for coexistence
Nothing to span the distance, now

Do we even know who we are
Living like all life is forfeit
Like we can just go redefine it
Regardless what we broke

Who died and made us stars
With our intellectual gambits
Our millionaire flair and our antics
We're like mirrors seen through smoke

I tried a shanty with the fool to find my pace
Anything from puns to jests to intertwine our ways

But there was no loyalty to hope
And funny the need for mercy
How it makes us bleed all mercy, now

Do we even know who we are...

Now the melody's void of sympathy
cos that shit's in byte size bits on YouTube
so tell me what am I supposed to do
When the malady's no remedy
Till we reach the lowest absolute
And necessity will finally force something through what's walling you

Do we even know who we are..."

I guess the idea that comes up with this song is that our image isn't clear, if we look we aren't sure of what life means, and with it all the actions we take... it kinda makes life seem like a mistery. But there are sentences i found hard to understand, let's take the first one.... my possible interpretationis that in our youth we still don't get the reality in this world, and we're out of reach from understanding that reality....

Please feel free to comment this sentence, or another one if you like, you may even choose another song.
Remember this is a Topic for different points of view and knowing them will only make us richer.

This is a great idea! I also realize other threads have been made discussing lyrics, but I agree with you. We need one that is completely open to everything POTF lyric-related. I love Smoke and Mirrors because I personally agree with everything Marko's saying.

This is also my favorite part of the song:


...and I think I know why I like it so much. It's true that we are fed so many lies as we grow up. We are conditioned to only follow the system so that we do not stray outside the norm; the accepted. Our egos become larger and much more complex as we are more and more conditioned by school, work, people, politics, religion, etc... Eventually we lose sight of who we really are. As young, unconditioned children, we have a natural sense of higher consciousness, the ultimate truth, and an awareness of who we are. As we age, we rely more and more on that self-doubting ego that criticizes the self and everyone around it. We become so caught up in the stresses of life because of this that some of us eventually stop caring. "Living like all life is forfeit" was a really great line for me because it's so true... The annoying ego we all have tells us that life is all about money and material things...it's all about having "more" than someone else. We fill the voids in our hearts with material things and people that we think will make us happy but only we can fill that void. We fail to give into who we really are: essentially we are all perfect without our egos telling us to do bad or good things for the world. But we still have our egos, and occasionally we do get arrogant about things; thus the line "who died and made us stars, with our intellectual gambits, our millionaire flair and our antics...". We think we are so great when others see us as smart or wealthy, but it's just the ego...

Anyway...I could go on for hours, but I think this will do it for now.

That's a very good answer, i guess you already disclosed all the essentials of the lyrics!
It's answers like this that make us learn.
I'm open for more replies about this song, or going to a another one.

I think Smoke and Mirrors is a personal song about the career of POTF. It questions the issues of them not being "stars". They might think that all life is forfeit because they are not yet huge "stars" and they are like mirrors seen through smoke because of people thinking: "Why aren't these guys superstars?" The millionaire flair and gambits and antics might refer to their career-boost with the help of Max Payne 2.

It might also be about that hamartia aspect mentioned in many interviewes: The fatal mistake, and a thought: "Is this really what I wanted?". The lyrics maybe tell about the past choices misleading the teller. The theme of the album is like the "theater" of the end, like twilight. Curtain calls, the sun sets etc... Then they don't know what to do to break through when that shit's in byte size bits on youtube. It's not as good way to get known as Remedy. But slowly the word spreads and necessity will finally force something through what's walling you. And that's how POTF will get BIG.

The lyrics are indeed interesting and they touch us as fans. Well, I don't know if it's that subjective or is it objective But this is the idea that comes to my mind when listening to S&M.........

This thread is a fantastic idea . I for one love to hear people's different opinions about a songs meaning because there are often many ways in which you can decipher a song. Keeping them in one thread is also a brilliant idea.

By one side it's kinda good POTF don't get too BIG because then they'll have other offers and they may fall where many artists have fallen before, they sell their souls to the record label and they wont the amazing music they do nowadays, but of course a band needs to rise, sometimes that's just unnavoidable...
The opinion that S&M refers to their carreer is very plausible but in fact, all the opinions about the lyrics may be correct, as they allow us to drift through enormous possibilities aplying to what we feel it's right, but it's always good to know what other people when they heay their songs, speaking by myself, it makes me understand more and more after each day that passes that POTF are a HUGE band in every sense of the word. I'´ve been accompanning them since 2006 after i played Max payne 2 and heard late goodbye, many times i've stop hearing them and the same number times i've restarted it because there is no way i can escape what music means to me, even after what I turned to listen was turning heavier and heavier, when i started hearing POTF i didnt hear nothing that was Metall, now more than 50 % of what i hear is Metal, and even that i never stop hearing POTF.

that's totally my point.
Now maybe we should move to another song, i would like to suggest Dying to live, but of course you may take another, i just chose this one because it leaves a bit confused at some points, feel free to comment.

I love the lyrics in this song!


Maybe the title is named for a trick performed by a magician into fooling those in the audience that something has disappeared when in reality it was slight of hand and misdirection (lovely lady assistants, works for both sexes, not necessarily in the same way). So is the title telling the listener something before the song even begins? I don't know since I did not write it but it's interesting to think about. I don't have access to Marko so I can't ask him what inspired him to write anything.


@gabiruman

POTF is the most amazing band ever aren't they? I think so and it seems you do too. Now wouldn't you like to share them with the world? I would. Why not share something that is precious? I mean I could keep it for myself and want it to stay only with me, but then no one else would get to enjoy it and I was taught to share.

Every band in the world has the potential to "fail" (I am thinking you mean losing fans? I'm not sure so maybe you can let me know if I am wrong). It doesn't matter if the band stays with an independent label or signs with a major label. I think they are smart enough to find a way to maintain their autonomy if a large record label wanted to sign them. It would be a choice, not something forced on them.

Also they are doing all promotions on their own, so that means money out of their pockets. Maybe they want more money in their pockets. I am not inferring they are greedy in any way, they just have to live like everyone else and put food on the table, pay for shelter, if they have a family they have to consider them.

I seem to remember the band saying they would love to come to the US or Australia or some other place in the world but they need financial support. Just curious, if they do sign with a major label do they have to give up all rights? I mean can they keep their own independent label and work with a bigger one at the same time? I have no idea how those deals work but I am curious.

@ Snow

I didn't say say i wouldn't like to share them with the world, in fact i show them to my friends and encorage them to listen to them.

I'm not sure you got it but i said "FALL" xD and no it's not similar to fail in this case, it has only to do with losing that "thing"they have that makes us go around, if you know what i mean.
As for the label, you maybe be wrong when you think they can mantain all they were doing, major labels put enormous pressure upon artists to do different things, why do you think that most artists have one or two records totally a different style rom the rest? its because of interests either from the label, or someone influencing the label, then they promise to offer more to the artists if they do something as they wnat them to do, and of course most artists will eventually give in.

I also know bands have their own costs, that's why I say that eventually they succumb to what the label wants them to do, sometimes a band needs to go through a "darker" time if they want to keep up, money makes the world go around.

And they have already gone to the US, however, Portugal which is closer... (my country) they havent.... i would definatly like to seem them live it's one of my dreams, and i still don't have enough independency to get myself on plane and go to finland or some other nordic country they play in.

Answering your doubt, i think the answer is no, major labels want them exclusively, and i dont think let them keep up with another one... and besides it wouldnt make that much sense to have 2 labels... they can´t just be doing two different types of work...

@gabiruman

I am sorry I misunderstood you. My bad for sure!

Yes POTF did come to the US once........they were in Los Angeles for one small concert for one day and I wish I had known about them at the time, although I live in Nashville which is no where near LA .

I am hoping they come back and play in more areas but if they don't........I will have to go to them . It's also a dream of mine to see POTF live. I think most everyone here has the same dream.

Maybe they will get to Portugal! They are closer like you said. I hope they do! Too bad I can't pick up North America and place it near Finland !

As far as the record label question it seems a band or singer can have more than one while producing an album. Apple Records, a division of Apple Corps project, was created by The Beatles when they had a contract with Parlophone in the UK and Capitol in the US. Under a new recording deal EMI and Capitol agreed to distribute Apple Records till 1975 and EMI retained the rights to Beatles recordings. The albums were issued on the Apple Records label but they carried Parlophone's catalog numbers. Apple does possess the rights to Beatles' videos and movie clips. I don't know all the "ins and outs" of their deals, but obviously they were contracted with more than one label; of course I don't know if that is still practiced or if they were the only ones to do this. You might know more about this than I do since I just Googled it. I am not familiar with the recording industry although I will research some on my own since I find it interesting now.

I think musicians make the music they want to make and if they change the style of the music that is up to them. I have been reading about many famous bands, Yes, The Beatles, Queen, Bruce Springsteen and the E-Street Band and if you know of any of them you know their records are not all alike. Now maybe an artist or a band changes the sound to be more commercially friendly and maybe some record labels put pressure on them, but I do know that Columbia put out Bruce Springsteen's albums even when Springsteen wasn't commercially successful and from what I have read Columbia was not the reason Bruce started writing commercially viable songs. I could be wrong there and I know of at least one very big Springsteen fan on the board and there are probably others (I really like Bruce for more than just musical reasons and love some of his songs but I am not a die hard fan) who can set me straight. I do know about Queen though since I am big fan of theirs! I loved Freddy Mercury and I was extremely sad when he died. They changed their sound many times and I know it was because they wanted to, not because a record company told them to. I don't think any of the artists I mentioned above would ever bow to a record label's pressure. I think I'm pretty correct about that point.

I think POTF will always do their "thing" no matter what, just like the artists I previously mentioned. I am not worried about it .

you may be right about the record labels, however the beatles are an old case and besides they were huge at the time... i don't think an artist like in roadrunner records or columbia would have another label at the same time you see to me it seems like it's almost the same as book labels there is never more than one putting out the same book at the market, but who knows there might be exceptions.

As for the pressure thing, my comment based itself mainly on Dream Theater, they made 4 fantastic albuns all of them from the same style, and then in 1997 they made a totally different thing. And they confessed that Falling to Infinity (the album) was influenced by their label "oh you should try doing something more commercial and that...." and they did... though, it was their only work like that, after that they returned to what they were, you see, with this case there's something wrong, they were influenced so they could be more commercial but i think the effect was exactly the contrary i didn't read it anywhere but i'm pretty that album wasn't high on selling, because everywhere i read about DT it says that album was their worst. Well of course this a point of view of a fan, maybe that album conquered other fans that weren't following DT or that didn't like the style of the other albuns, but the balance is still negative. There are many interest behind it, sometimes it's not just to make them sell more, it's only to a different thing, there is even people who think a band must have a darker time and then rise again, sometimes it's outside influences, sometimes the own band wants it.
Like Metallica in the Load and Reload albuns, they changed their sound, they changed their looks, cut off their hair, it was a big shock, but that must have been their choice, the same with St Anger, James Hetfield said that album was from releasing inner deamons from his rehab, and it really sounded like shit, the drums sounded like trash cans.

But well there all types of cases of bands that change, even POTF changed a bit on RR but i don't think it was worst or better, just a bit different and it was awesome as well, a band needs to try new things so they can evolve in music some times it goes well sometimes it doesn't.

And maybe we should get back to the topic xD

Dying to Live was the next suggestion!

Let's start with the meaning of this song's lyrics or you may suggest another one.

To my mind the whole TT album is very personal. So, Dying to live (surprise surprise) tells about POTF career. The winding road=choices and their consequences, the silent wall=like "what next?", find the question="What do I want?". They wonder if they have deceived themselves by wanting the musical career success... Yup, tha hamartia theme!

It definatly has to do with the choices POTF or if we want to apply to us i guess it'll do as well and everybody is afraid the choices won't turn out to be good "like i'm fearful that my choices are all wrong".
i just don't exactly got the part "I know the way you go cos i've lived your life of make believe, dying to live" it kinda confuses me xD

@gabiruman

I know The Beatles were a huge success....um who doesn't? I mean they really made their mark in the music world and no band will ever be like them as far as I am concerned. But it doesn't change the fact that they did have more than one label at a time during their recording history.

I didn't know your comments about the music industry was focused on Dream Theater. I don't know the band very well, although I have heard some of their music and what I did hear was good. Maybe if you had started off with talking about DT and how they changed I could have answered your post better.


I don't see the comparison with books and records. I know a lot about the book publishing industry if you want to talk about it sometime but I don't see what that has to do with the record industry.

The rest of what you said above in the post directed at me is a bit hard to follow. I mean you talk about labels who pressure bands but then you say that maybe the bands want to make changes in music or appearance (I don't know what appearance has to do with this discussion though.......) so now what is it that you are saying? I'm not sure. I don't know what you mean about a "darker time" so I can't really comment there.

You did comment on RR and said it is different than the first two POTF albums. You didn't think it worse or better than Signs Of Life or Carnival Of Rust and that you thought it was awesome and that bands need to try new things. So honestly I don't see what you are saying. I am sure you are making some kind of point here but I am not sure what it is so I am going to say anymore unless you want to keep this conversation going . I am not trying to argue with you here, I just wanted to understand your point, so please don't take what I said the wrong way......I was merely answering your post to me.

You guys enjoy your discussion .

@ snow

I'll try to make myself understand.
I gave DT as an example but i've many other similar stories, don't ask me names cause i don't remember them, as i love DT it stayed on my mind.

What i meant with books and music was only the label, i don't know if in the books you call it "label" too, but i thought i made myself clear, as in the world of books there is a "label" for a certain book, in the world of music there is a label for each band (normally, there may be exceptions as i previosly said).

Appearence has to do with what we're talking, if you're referring to bands changing their style subject, as i said Metallica changed their style along with their appearence. Same happened with DT. Their looks and appearence has a direct connection with the type of music thy play, so normally they change together.
there was no maybe in bands changing forgive if i was too confuse, the truth is: some bands change by the pressure the label puts on them, other bands change because they want to, it depends on many factors. By "darker time" i mean the period of time in which the band (according to the fans) has made an album or albuns that were not quite as they expected, in a negative way.

I don't see what you didn't understand on the RR comment... i think i'm not the only one to agree that RR has a slightly different sound than the other two, they turned a bit heavier, and used 7 string guitars. This comment was connected to the other one above, they changed a bit, they tried new things, and sometimes that's what bands need to do to evolve as a band in music. In the case of POTF it was not a bad experience in my opinion as i think RR is awesome!

I hope i made myself clear

Fine I understand the DT thing.

Books having labels like bands? Do you mean titles or publishers? See that is what I am not understanding, I'm sorry. So no if I am still saying I don't know what it is you are trying to say then it was not clear; at least not clear to me. If you don't know what something is called regarding books then how can you expect me to follow you?

You keep telling me that what you are writing down is very obvious and I should immediately understand. I might not be the smartest person in the world or a rocket scientist but if you would please stop with condescending attitude and try to explain some more about what you are thinking, since I am not a mind reader as well, then I might understand you. But at this point I can't see going on with this conversation since it is becoming ridiculous.

yes i meant publisher i didn't remember the word, i was expecting you could guess it, i don't know all the words in english.
As for the rest, if you don't understand it... well it can't get more clearer than what it is, i don't if you're skipping lines or if you just don't want to even try it.
I told even more than necessary.
And what attitude are you talking about? Man when you first posted i sympathized with and tried to explain all my points of view as I could, you said you didn't understand and i tried to explain better, honestly i don't what you want anymore.

Well if you rest your case on understanding the very confusing person that I am, we should get back to the topic.

Dying to live is the current lyric discussion.

Since no one replied i would like to remember you guys to keep posting, the song we were discussing was Dying to Live
(and sorry for the latest "argue" with snow that took us away from the topic)

Maybe mine is a bit of an 'obvious' interpretation, but "Dying To Live" makes me think of when you see someone going through what you have already been through in the past, and you'd just want to help them out, would want to make them see that this will pass, you see them wondering over questions you'd been having at the time, and finally you feel like you have the answers to those questions.
Parts of it can also seem a conversation to a "younger self". Maybe it's a bit of a mix of the two things.

Or maybe that's just because that's how I often feel when I see someone who's younger than me going through the doubts and problems I had at their age, and it makes me feel like that.
I always feel I relate a lot to potf lyrics, but often I also have been questioning if I really 'see' their meanings or if I just unconsciously make the lyrics fit on how I'm feeling, somehow.
but in the end, songs are also for this, for finding pieces of yourself in that, that's why a great songs speak to so many different people, because they have many "levels of interpretation", you can always find new meanings in them

@ Lisa

That's what i thought too, but i would like to see if others thought the same xD And maybe that's the real purpose of the song.
Feel free to post if you have another opinion or else we'll go to a new one.

To me the joy of PotF is that everyone can listen to the songs and read the lyrics and take away something different from them. Where I see a butterfly on the ink blot you might see a rabbit and so on. Like, I can see reality filtering into the lyrics but when I hear the songs themselves I see stories playing out in my mind and that could just be how I'm wired. It is nice to know, though, that people take the time to look at the lyrics and discuss what they mean.

You're damn right about that, i hate to see people hearing shit music and even more when they don't even care about the lyrics. Ignorance...

Hello all!

So, apart from the tumultuous joy of typing down my 1st post here , I am equally joyous to share my few thoughts on this song called "Dying to live" from POTF's 4th album "Twilight Theater" .

I have always been the kind of a person for whom the song lyrics are of paramount importance. A song devoid of a meaningful lyrics is like a corpse devoid of a soul. POTF has been one of the bands who always manage to write cryptic (yes, thats the word) lyrics , with each word beautifully weaved with music. It strikes the soul! Although, a song or a poem could have as many interpretations as the number of interpretors , yet I will congratulate the thread starter to have come up with an idea to DISCUSS lyrics! So, I see a certain "like mindedness " here.

Without digressing, I am now coming on to the song "dying to live" .... The title in itself is intriguing, isn't it ? The person who is addressing to another person has himself gone through the same plight, the same misery of life wherein we become a "VICTIM" of our own conscious selves and after being supressed for so long and being forcefully stifled to death by our own notions, our mind finally revokes and tries to break free (And thus the line "dying to live")

All our lives, we pretend to live ("Masquerade for life you hide behind") and when we realize the growing voidness within, we try to seek an answer to a question "WHAT NEXT?"

Thats my interpretation. I would highly welcome some constructive suggestions. People, please pour in your views, it would be a treat for me!

Adios!

Thanks for sharing my friend, first of all welcome to this forum, i find your opinion very constructive in deed.
I would like to present my appologies for keeping this thread "offline", but i haven't really got the time, but now i would like to incentivate you guys to keep giving your own opinions about POTF's lyrics. I'll would like to suggest Sorry go'round, the most obvious interpretation may be the critic to our society has everyone wants all the new tendencies and they only care bout material things, the growing ignorance. Yet i would like to hear some of your toughts about it

I think a lot of the songs have lyrics involving misplaced trust.
Carnival of Rust, Smoke and Mirrors, Heal My Wounds, Illusion and Dream to name a few.

Ok maybe I'm off topic but I don't know where I can ask my question on some lyrics in "More".

It is written:

"More, just to be sure
I got what I wanted, so naturally I want more
What I paid for, entertain me now
All I want is more, cos I like it
Too good to let it go, keep it coming
Cos I want more, cos I'm not sure
What I really wanted, so all I want is more..."

Instead of "so all I want" Marko sings something else, some words I can't understand. I've listened to the song (btw one of my fav ) hundreds of times and I still don't understand the words... It's like they did not exist in English... but I'm sure they do... it's so frustrating when English is not your mother tongue! So, please, if someone could help I would be eternally grateful!!!

This is "so fine to say I want more" That's what I hear.

Thank you for your quick reply!

Yup that's what I seem to hear too.